WRONG!

[Peter da Silva]

Let's see if we can avoid the flames, boys and girls...

In article ... donegan at stanton.TCC.COM (Steven P. Donegan) writes:
> In article <837 at .UUCP>, peter at ficc.UUCP (Peter da Silva) (that's me) writes:

> > > Someone wrote:
> > > >	3) The message base, file handling, and bulletins (motd and others)
> > > >	   use non-standard layouts and fixed length record formats.

> > Someone else (presumably the author of xbbs) replied with a flip
> > response to the effect:
> > > They are MY format; therefore they are standard for xbbs!

> So I took it upon myself to point out:
> > Fixed length record files are very rarely appropriate for a UNIX system.
> > Certainly a low-performance application like a BBS doesn't need them.
> > The downside obvious: you can't use an editor on them...

> Gosh Peter (FLAMES ON), I have been using vi on my XBBS bulletins, control
> files and motd's for ages. You tell me that it's obvious that I can't do
> what I've been doing for about 2 years?

And the message base? Now then, I haven't used xbbs myself: my own unix
based BBS is quite good enough for my purposes. However, based on the
statements above it's not unreasonable to assume that "the message base,
file handling, ... [of xbbs] use ... fixed length record formats". The
author of the program didn't deny that, so I assumed that it was true. I
thought it worthwhile to point out that fixed length record files have
certain disadvantages.

Now then, based on *your* reply I must assume that at least the bulletins,
control files, and motds are not a fixed record format. You didn't mention
the message base and (I presume) user files and mailboxes, so might I assume
that these are really fixed-length record files?

OK, let's go on...

> I am getting rather sick of the totally unfounded and obviously uninformed
> comments of quite a few different individuals on Sandy's XBBS system. Most
> downside comments I've seen here so far prove that the individuals making
> the comments have never actually installed/operated/managed an XBBS system.

No, but I have installed, operated, and managed several other BBS systems
of my own and others devising. I have used systems (and to my shame written
one) that have fixed length record files, as well as systems that use
standard UNIX-style text files. I must say that it was *much* more pleasant
to work on the latter.

> I also take exception to the 'low-performance application' comment. XBBS is
> a very efficient, fast, responsive system that hides system load well. Users
> of the XBBS system note very little response degradation on a heavily loaded
> system, much less than a shell user on the same system.

A bulletin board is a low performance application. It does not require fast
response time, nor does it require a lot of number crunching. In general,
a bulletin board system is limited by the physical I/O speed of the disk
drives more than anything else -- including parsing message headers and
responding to keystrokes. You might very well have a fast bulletin board,
but I really doubt that fixed-length record files should be given the
credit.

> Come on folks, before flaming someones efforts to provide FREE software of
> any variety at least:

Here is where I would definitely flame on if I were the type to do so. I
did not flame the author of XBBS. I merely pointed out a well-established
fact about unix-based systems, to wit that all the tools are oriented
towards text files.

>   Try it before bitching.

I have.

>   Bitch constructively.

I though I was.

>   Make sure of your FACTS.

No-one can ever be 100% sure of their facts. One can only operate on the
best information available to them. The best information I have, based on
messages from the author of the software, among other people, is that it
does not use text files to store user messages. I believe this is a
mistake. I have explained why.

Next time, before flaming, go check out news.announce.newusers.
-- 
-- Peter da Silva, Ferranti International Controls Corporation.
-- Phone: 713-274-5180. Remote UUCP: hoptoad!academ!uhnix1!sugar!peter.